03 December 2008

Richard Dawkins: The God of the Old Testament

(Repost with Bible verses that support Richard Dawkins' description of the Old Testament God. Let me know if I've left out some good verses -- I started to poop out toward the end.)

The God of the Old Testament is arguably the most unpleasant character in all fiction: jealous and proud of it; a petty, unjust, unforgiving control-freak; a vindictive, bloodthirsty ethnic cleanser; a misogynistic, homophobic, racist, infanticidal, genocidal, filicidal, pestilential, megalomaniacal, sadomasochistic, capriciously malevolent bully.

The God of the Old Testament is arguably the most unpleasant character in all fiction:

jealous and proud of it

How jealous and proud is he? Well, his name is Jealous. And he named himself!

For thou shalt worship no other god: for the LORD, whose name is Jealous, is a jealous God: Exodus 34:14

Here are some more verses where God brags about his jealousy.

I the Lord thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation. Exodus 20:5
For the LORD thy God is a consuming fire, even a jealous God. Deuteronomy 4:24
I the LORD thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation. Deuteronomy 5:9
(For the LORD thy God is a jealous God among you) lest the anger of the LORD thy God be kindled against thee, and destroy thee from off the face of the earth. Deuteronomy 6:15
The LORD will not spare him, but then the anger of the LORD and his jealousy shall smoke against that man, and all the curses that are written in this book shall lie upon him, and the LORD shall blot out his name from under heaven. Deuteronomy 29:20
They provoked him to jealousy with strange gods, with abominations provoked they him to anger. Deuteronomy 32:16
They have moved me to jealousy with that which is not God; they have provoked me to anger with their vanities: and I will move them to jealousy with those which are not a people; I will provoke them to anger with a foolish nation. Deuteronomy 32:21
He is a jealous God; he will not forgive your transgressions nor your sins. Joshua 24:19
And Judah did evil in the sight of the LORD, and they provoked him to jealousy with their sins. 1 Kings 14:22
And he put forth the form of an hand, and took me by a lock of mine head; and the spirit lifted me up between the earth and the heaven, and brought me in the visions of God to Jerusalem, to the door of the inner gate that looketh toward the north; where was the seat of the image of jealousy, which provoketh to jealousy. Ezekiel 8:3
Then said he unto me, Son of man, lift up thine eyes now the way toward the north. So I lifted up mine eyes the way toward the north, and behold northward at the gate of the altar this image of jealousy in the entry. Ezekiel 8:5
I will judge thee, as women that break wedlock and shed blood are judged; and I will give thee blood in fury and jealousy. Ezekiel 16:38
So will I make my fury toward thee to rest, and my jealousy shall depart from thee, and I will be quiet, and will be no more angry. Ezekiel 16:42
And I will set my jealousy against thee, and they shall deal furiously with thee: they shall take away thy nose and thine ears; and thy remnant shall fall by the sword: they shall take thy sons and thy daughters; and thy residue shall be devoured by the fire. Ezekiel 23:25
Surely in the fire of my jealousy have I spoken against the residue of the heathen. Ezekiel 36:5
For in my jealousy and in the fire of my wrath have I spoken, Surely in that day there shall be a great shaking in the land of Israel. Ezekiel 38:19
God is jealous, and the LORD revengeth; the LORD revengeth, and is furious; Nahum 1:2
Thus saith the LORD of hosts; I am jealous for Jerusalem and for Zion with a great jealousy. Zechariah 1:14
Thus saith the LORD of hosts; I was jealous for Zion with great jealousy, and I was jealous for her with great fury. Zechariah 8:2
All the earth shall be devoured with the fire of my jealousy. Zephaniah 3:8
a petty,
A golden bell and a pomegranate ... shall be upon Aaron to minister: and his sound shall be heard when he goeth in unto the holy place before the LORD, and when he cometh out, that he die not. Exodus 28:34-35

Ye shall keep my statutes. Thou shalt not let thy cattle gender with a diverse kind: thou shalt not sow thy field with mingled seed: neither shall a garment mingled of linen and woollen come upon thee. Leviticus 19:19

Thou shalt not sacrifice unto the LORD thy God any bullock, or sheep, wherein is blemish, or any evilfavouredness: for that is an abomination unto the LORD thy God. Deuteronomy 17:1

Thou shalt not wear a garment of divers sorts, as of woollen and linen together. Deuteronomy 22:11

Thou shalt make thee fringes upon the four quarters of thy vesture, wherewith thou coverest thyself. Deuteronomy 22:12

He that is wounded in the stones, or hath his privy member cut off, shall not enter into the congregation of the LORD. Deuteronomy 23:1

A bastard shall not enter into the congregation of the LORD; even to his tenth generation. Deuteronomy 23:2

unjust,
If thou refuse to let him go, behold, I will slay thy son, even thy firstborn. Exodus 4:23

The LORD slew all the firstborn in the land of Egypt, both the firstborn of man, and the firstborn of beast. Exodus 13:15

I the LORD thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation. Exodus 20:5

Prepare slaughter for his children for the iniquity of their fathers. Isaiah 14:21

See here for a list of Old Testament injustices.

unforgiving

He is a jealous God; he will not forgive your transgressions nor your sins. Joshua 24:19

Therefore pray not thou for this people, neither lift up a cry or prayer for them: for I will not hear them in the time that they cry unto me for their trouble. Jeremiah 11:14

When they fast, I will not hear their cry; and when they offer burnt offering and an oblation, I will not accept them: but I will consume them by the sword, and by the famine, and by the pestilence. Jeremiah 14:12

Therefore will I also deal in fury: mine eye shall not spare, neither will I have pity: and though they cry in mine ears with a loud voice, yet will I not hear them. Ezekiel 8:18

control-freak;
But it shall come to pass, if thou wilt not hearken unto the voice of the LORD thy God, to observe to do all his commandments and his statutes which I command thee this day; that all these curses shall come upon thee, and overtake thee: ... The LORD will smite thee with the botch of Egypt, and with the emerods (hemorrhoids), and with the scab, and with the itch, whereof thou canst not be healed. The LORD shall smite thee with madness, and blindness, and astonishment of heart: ... Thou shalt betroth a wife, and another man shall lie with her: ... The LORD shall smite thee in the knees, and in the legs, with a sore botch that cannot be healed, from the sole of thy foot unto the top of thy head. ... And thou shalt eat the fruit of thine own body, the flesh of thy sons and of thy daughters ... The tender and delicate woman among you, which would not adventure to set the sole of her foot upon the ground for delicateness and tenderness, her eye shall be evil toward the husband of her bosom, and toward her son, and toward her daughter, And toward her young one that cometh out from between her feet, and toward her children which she shall bear: for she shall eat them. Deuteronomy 28:15-68
a vindictive,
I kill .. I wound ... I will render vengeance to mine enemies ... I will make mine arrows drunk with blood, and my sword shall devour flesh. Deuteronomy 32:39-42

He will avenge the blood of his servants, and will render vengeance to his adversaries. Deuteronomy 32:43

To me belongeth vengeance and recompence ... for the day of their calamity is at hand. Deuteronomy 32:35

And when the people complained, it displeased the LORD: and the LORD heard it; and his anger was kindled; and the fire of the LORD burnt among them, and consumed them. Nunbers 11:1

Therefore thus saith the LORD of hosts, Behold, I will punish them: the young men shall die by the sword; their sons and their daughters shall die by famine: Jeremiah 11:22

For this is the day of the Lord GOD of hosts, a day of vengeance, that he may avenge him of his adversaries: and the sword shall devour, and it shall be satiate and made drunk with their blood. Jeremiah 46:10

And I will execute vengeance in anger and fury upon the heathen, such as they have not heard. Micah 5:15

bloodthirsty

And the priest shall dip his finger in some of the blood, and sprinkle it seven times before the LORD. Leviticus 4:17

And ye shall eat the flesh of your sons, and the flesh of your daughters shall ye eat. Leviticus 26:29

I kill .. I wound ... I will make mine arrows drunk with blood, and my sword shall devour flesh. Deuteronomy 32:39-42

But God shall wound the head of his enemies ... That thy foot may be dipped in the blood of thine enemies, and the tongue of thy dogs in the same. Psalm 68:21-23

For the indignation of the LORD is upon all nations, and his fury upon all their armies: he hath utterly destroyed them, he hath delivered them to the slaughter. Their slain also shall be cast out, and their stink shall come up out of their carcases, and the mountains shall be melted with their blood. Isaiah 34:2-3

For my sword shall be bathed in heaven. Isaiah 34:5

The sword of the LORD is filled with blood, ... their land shall be soaked with blood, ... For it is the day of the LORD's vengeance. Isaiah 34:7-8

And I will feed them that oppress thee with their own flesh; and they shall be drunken with their own blood, as with sweet wine. Isaiah 49:26

I will ... trample them in my fury; and their blood ... will stain all my raiment. Isaiah 63:2-6

And I will cause them to eat the flesh of their sons and the flesh of their daughters, and they shall eat every one the flesh of his friend. Jeremiah 19:9

For this is the day of the Lord GOD of hosts, a day of vengeance, that he may avenge him of his adversaries: and the sword shall devour, and it shall be satiate and made drunk with their blood. Jeremiah 46:10

Cursed be he that keepeth back his sword from blood. Jeremiah 48:10

Thus saith the Lord GOD; Speak unto every feathered fowl, and to every beast of the field, Assemble yourselves, and come; gather yourselves on every side to my sacrifice that I do sacrifice for you, even a great sacrifice upon the mountains of Israel, that ye may eat flesh, and drink blood. Ezekiel 39:17

Ye shall eat the flesh of the mighty, and drink the blood of the princes of the earth. Ezekiel 39:18

And ye shall eat fat till ye be full, and drink blood till ye be drunken, of my sacrifice which I have sacrificed for you. Ezekiel 39:19

And I will bring distress upon men, that they shall walk like blind men, because they have sinned against the LORD: and their blood shall be poured out as dust, and their flesh as the dung. Zephaniah 1:17

See here for a list of Old Testament cruelties.

ethnic cleanser;

Thou shalt surely smite the inhabitants of that city with the edge of the sword, destroying it utterly, and all that is therein, and the cattle thereof, with the edge of the sword. Deuteronomy 13:15

Thus saith the LORD of hosts ... go and smite Amalek, and utterly destroy all that they have, and spare them not; but slay both man and woman, infant and suckling, ox and sheep, camel and ass. 1 Samuel 15:2-3

a misogynistic,

Behold now, I have two daughters which have not known man; let me, I pray you, bring them out unto you, an do ye to them as is good in your eyes. Genesis 19:8

Wherefore David arose and went, he and his men, and slew of the Philistines two hundred men; and David brought their foreskins, and they gave them in full tale to the king, that he might be the king's son in law. And Saul gave him Michal his daughter to wife. 1 Samuel 18:27

And whosoever lieth carnally with a woman, that is a bondmaid, betrothed to an husband, and not at all redeemed, nor freedom given her; she shall be scourged. Leviticus 19:20

And the daughter of any priest, if she profane herself by playing the whore, she profaneth her father: she shall be burnt with fire. Leviticus 21:9

And Moses said unto them, Have ye saved all the women alive? ... Now therefore kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman that hath known man by lying with him. But all the women children, that have not known a man by lying with him, keep alive for yourselves. Nunbers 31:15-19

And when the LORD thy God hath delivered it into thine hands, thou shalt smite every male thereof with the edge of the sword: But the women ... shalt thou take unto thyself. Deuteronomy 20:13-14

And seest among the captives a beautiful woman, and hast a desire unto her .... Thou shalt go in unto her. Deuteronomy 21:11-13

If a man have two wives, one beloved, and another hated .... Deuteronomy 21:15

If any man take a wife, and go in unto her, and hate her ... Deuteronomy 22:13

I took this woman, and when I came to her, I found her not a maid. Then shall the father of the damsel, and her mother, take and bring forth the tokens of the damsel's virginity unto the elders of the city. But if ... the tokens of virginity be not found for the damsel: Then they shall bring out the damsel to the door of her father's house, and the men of her city shall stone her with stones that she die. Deuteronomy 22:14-21

If a damsel that is a virgin be betrothed unto an husband, and a man find her in the city, and lie with her; Then ye shall bring them both out unto the gate of that city, and ye shall stone them with stones that they die; the damsel, because she cried not, being in the city. Deuteronomy 22:23-24

When two men strive together on with another, and the wife of the one ... putteth forth her hand, and taketh him by the secrets: Then thou shalt cut off her hand, thine eye shall not pity her. Deuteronomy 25:11-12

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30

Wherefore David arose and went, he and his men, and slew of the Philistines two hundred men; and David brought their foreskins, and they gave them in full tale to the king, that he might be the king's son in law. And Saul gave him Michal his daughter to wife. 1 Samuel 18:27

Thus saith the LORD, Behold, I will raise up evil against thee out of thine own house, and I will take thy wives before thine eyes, and give them unto thy neighbour, and he shall lie with thy wives in the sight of this sun. 2 Samuel 12:11

And her daughters which are in the field shall be slain by the sword; and they shall know that I am the LORD Ezekiel 26:6

homophobic,

Thou shalt not lie with mankind, as with womankind: it is abomination. Leviticus 18:22

If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them. Leviticus 20:13

racist,

One of the children of Israel came and brought unto his brethren a Midianitish woman in the sight of Moses ... And when Phinehas ... saw it, he rose up from among the congregation, and took a javelin in his hand; And he went after the man of Israel into the tent, and thrust both of them through, the man of Israel, and the woman through her belly. So the plague was stayed from the children of Israel. Numbers 25:6-8

The LORD thy God hath chosen thee to be a special people unto himself, above all people that are upon the face of the earth. Deuteronomy 7:6

An Ammonite or Moabite shall not enter into the congregation of the LORD; even to their tenth generation shall they not enter into the congregation of the LORD for ever. Deuteronomy 23:3

infanticidal,

At midnight the LORD smote all the firstborn in the land of Egypt, from the firstborn of Pharaoh that sat on his throne unto the firstborn of the captive that was in the dungeon. Exodus 12:29

Ye shall sow your seed in vain, for your enemies shall eat it. Leviticus 26:16

I will also send wild beasts among you, which shall rob you of your children. Leviticus 26:22

And ye shall eat the flesh of your sons, and the flesh of your daughters shall ye eat. Leviticus 26:29

Because by this deed thou hast given great occasion to the enemies of the LORD to blaspheme, the child also that is born unto thee shall surely die. ... And the LORD struck the child that Uriah's wife bare unto David, and it was very sick... on the seventh day, that the child died. 2 Samuel 12:14-18

Therefore the fathers shall eat the sons in the midst of thee, and the sons shall eat their fathers. Ezekiel 5:10

And I will cause them to eat the flesh of their sons and the flesh of their daughters, and they shall eat every one the flesh of his friend. Jeremiah 19:9

genocidal,

Thou shalt surely smite the inhabitants of that city with the edge of the sword, destroying it utterly, and all that is therein, and the cattle thereof, with the edge of the sword. Deuteronomy 13:15

But of the cities of these people, which the LORD thy God doth give thee for an inheritance, thou shalt save alive nothing that breatheth. Deuteronomy 20:16-17

So smote all the country ... he left none remaining, but utterly destroyed all that breathed, as the LORD God of Israel commanded. Joshua 10:40

Thus saith the LORD of hosts ... go and smite Amalek, and utterly destroy all that they have, and spare them not; but slay both man and woman, infant and suckling, ox and sheep, camel and ass. 1 Samuel 15:2-3

filicidal,

And he said, Take now thy son, thine only son Isaac, whom thou lovest, and ... offer him there for a burnt offering. Genesis 22:2

For every one that curseth his father or his mother shall be surely put to death. Leviticus 20:9

And the daughter of any priest, if she profane herself by playing the whore, she profaneth her father: she shall be burnt with fire. Leviticus 21:9

If thy brother, the son of thy mother, or thy son, or thy daughter, or the wife of thy bosom, or thy friend, which is as thine own soul, entice thee secretly, saying, Let us go and serve other gods ... hou shalt surely kill him; thine hand shall be first upon him to put him to death, and afterwards the hand of all the people. Deuteronomy 13:6-10

Happy shall he be, that taketh and dasheth thy little ones against the stones. Psalm 137:9

pestilential,

And while the flesh was yet between their teeth, ere it was chewed, the wrath of the LORD was kindled against the people, and the LORD smote the people with a very great plague. Nunbers 11:33

And the LORD sent fiery serpents among the people, and they bit the people; and much people of Israel died. Nunbers 21:6

The hand of the LORD was against the city ... and he smote the men of the city, both small and great, and they had emerods in their secret parts. 1 Samuel 5:9

So Gad came to David, and told him, and said unto him, Shall seven years of famine come unto thee in thy land? or wilt thou flee three months before thine enemies, while they pursue thee? or that there be three days' pestilence in thy land? ... So the LORD sent a pestilence upon Israel ... and there died of the people ... seventy thousand men. 2 Samuel 24:13

So will I send upon you famine and evil beasts, and they shall bereave thee: and pestilence and blood shall pass through thee; and I will bring the sword upon thee. I the LORD have spoken it. Ezekiel 5:17

megalomaniacal,

Then the earth shook and trembled; the foundations of heaven moved and shook, because he was wroth. There went up a smoke out of his nostrils, and fire out of his mouth devoured: coals were kindled by it. He bowed the heavens also, and came down; and darkness was under his feet. And he rode upon a cherub, and did fly. 2 Samuel 22:8-11

Thus will I magnify myself, and sanctify myself; and I will be known in the eyes of many nations, and they shall know that I am the LORD. Ezekiel 38:23

sadomasochistic,

Thou shalt even drink it and suck it out, and thou shalt break the sherds thereof, and pluck off thine own breasts: for I have spoken it, saith the Lord GOD. Ezekiel 23:34

capriciously malevolent

Slay utterly old and young, both maids, and little children, and women: but come not near any man upon whom is the mark ... fill the courts with the slain: go ye forth. And they went forth, and slew in the city. Ezekiel 9:4-7

Therefore will I also deal in fury: mine eye shall not spare, neither will I have pity: and though they cry in mine ears with a loud voice, yet will I not hear them. Ezekiel 8:18

And the cities that are inhabited shall be laid waste, and the land shall be desolate; and ye shall know that I am the LORD. Ezekiel 12:20

bully.
And I will appoint over them four kinds, saith the LORD: the sword to slay, and the dogs to tear, and the fowls of the heaven, and the beasts of the earth, to devour and destroy. Jeremiah 15:3

And I will call for a sword against him throughout all my mountains, saith the Lord GOD: every man's sword shall be against his brother. And I will plead against him with pestilence and with blood; and I will rain upon him, and upon his bands, and upon the many people that are with him, an overflowing rain, and great hailstones, fire, and brimstone. Thus will I magnify myself, and sanctify myself; and I will be known in the eyes of many nations, and they shall know that I am the LORD. Ezekiel 38:21-23

46 comments:

Hugo said...

That Is Awesome!
I've been waiting for someone to put that quote next to the actual scripture.
Thanks

Aquaria said...

It was learning that the reason we had to believe in god was because he was a jealous god that I got on my path to atheism. Before then I hadn't been too concerned about religion, but learning god had such a flaw made me think the whole god thing was a bunch of bs.

Thanks, Lutheran school 5th grade religious education!

Verification word: Evagica. The mis-spelled female hygiene product.

lockharts said...

wow dawkins lol gotta love him. Oh and can we please stop putting verses out of context....

Jealousy in God is not a flaw... If God was not jealous he would have left and forsaken us with our idols long ago. He definatly would not have sent his son.

Why is jealousy for us a sin? Because everything we have is from God and we don't deserve it. If we are jealous of something we are being materialistic and therefore not appreciative of what God gives us aka we are idol worshiping.

Jealousy in God must be seen as what God deserves... Therefore if it is not givin to Him he is naturally jealous of what he deserves not what he wants.

Overall I agree with dawkins, if He was a man, I really wouldn't like Him too much. Why would we listen to a guy that goes around saying He is better than us...

But He's not, therefore there is a lot more grace to all of this. If God was being "Just" we would have been smited and wiped from the Earth a long time ago. Yet God decided to perserver with His people (Israel) slowly restoring them.

Question: If God had not been so harsh on His people and had not told them to stay away from the other nations for corruptions sake, would there be the Church today or Christianity at all???

This is meant for debate, I would not try to convert people over the internet, thats not my point. So argue it with intellegence please...

Hugo said...

Okay lockhearts, I'll bite a little.
So a concept that means something to us means something else when applied to your god concept?
Then if it is black your brain will find a way to make it white when applied to your god.
I suggest you look up the special pleading argument.

Also what does it mean when you say: "would there be the Church today or Christianity at all"
just because it is believed by (many) people does not make it true (argument from popularity), have a look at hinduism if that is important for you.

And why did you just pick that attribute, there's still all these:
petty, unjust, unforgiving control-freak; vindictive, bloodthirsty ethnic cleanser; misogynistic, homophobic, racist, infanticidal, genocidal, filicidal, pestilential, megalomaniacal, sadomasochistic, capriciously malevolent bully

Maybe a bit harder even for your brain but I'd love to see you give it a try.


Did everyone see the new t-shirts on http://richarddawkins.net/ guess he read your mind Steve or was it a joint effort ;-)

Kamacharya said...

Question: If God had not been so harsh on His people and had not told them to stay away from the other nations for corruptions sake, would there be the Church today or Christianity at all???

My answer:
Probably not. Nor would there have been the advent of Islam either. Nor would the Dark Ages have happened, and we humans might be a thousand years ahead in technology than we are now.
I could be wearing rocket-boots and being served cocktails by sexy android waitresses right now if it wasn't for the theocracy that ruled over - and dumbed down - Europe after the fall of Rome!

Anon said...

Great (re)post. I'm just finishing listening to The God Delusion on audiobook, and I recognize this excerpt from the beginning. It's very interesting to see how well Dawkin's words match up with the Bible.

I would hate to be Aaron. I could see myself forgetting to put the bell on some day and being killed on the spot for it. I bet pastors are happy this one still isn't in effect.

Aquaria said:It was learning that the reason we had to believe in god was because he was a jealous god that I got on my path to atheism

For me, it was mostly the fact that God made/let people suffer, both in life and in the afterlife. But if I had known about all these jealousy verses earlier, it might have had a bigger impact.

lockharts said:Jealousy in God is not a flaw... If God was not jealous he would have left and forsaken us with our idols long ago. He definatly would not have sent his son.

You're saying that God sent his son to get crucified here on Earth because he was jealous. Couldn't God have thought of a better way than killing his son to convince us that we should worship him?

Jealousy in God must be seen as what God deserves...

I don't see how killing off Jesus gives God his due. I can understand the idea of God not wanting us to worship other gods, but Jesus dying on the cross didn't solve this since other religions still exist. If God really wants us to believe in him, couldn't Jesus come back down for a press conference and perform a few miracles for a global audience? I'm being completely serious. If God is there, why doesn't he just tell us? A lot more people would believe in him and be saved from hell.

If God was being "Just" we would have been smited and wiped from the Earth a long time ago.

If God was being just, would he still be punishing the human race for what Adam and Eve did thousands of year ago? He tried to smite everyone before to make things better (the flood), but it didn't work and he said he was sorry he did it.

If God had not been so harsh on His people and had not told them to stay away from the other nations for corruptions sake, would there be the Church today or Christianity at all???

This is an interesting way of thinking of it. I agree with Kamacharya, we'd probably be better off if it weren't for Christianity, as long as people weren't duped into some other religion, which I'm afraid probably would have happened though...Maybe I'm just being pessimistic, though.

james said...

Great post. And it's still going on! There are a few cartoons on god's actions at
this blog - hope they make you guys laugh! http://macleodcartoons.blogspot.com/2008/12/so-thats-where-it-came-from.html

http://macleodcartoons.blogspot.com/2008/12/mysterious-ways.html

http://macleodcartoons.blogspot.com/2008/12/vengeful-god.html

fenm said...

lockharts said:
"Why is jealousy for us a sin? Because everything we have is from God and we don't deserve it"

You mean like disease, and children with birth defects, and tsunamis that kill thousands of people? I agree that we don't deserve that.

Oh, wait, you probably meant just the good stuff God gives us, huh?

"Question: If God had not been so harsh on His people and had not told them to stay away from the other nations for corruptions sake, would there be the Church today or Christianity at all???"

You're operating under the assumption that lack of a Church and Christianity would be a bad thing...

kinzu-kiwi said...

Sometimes I wonder if God just acts tough to show His fans how "hard" He is.

What if He's a big sissy who's so scared of loosing his friends he has to do all this barbaric stuff or else he'll "loose his edge"?

Afterall, his books wouldn't have sold half as well if people knew what a goody-two-shoes he is.

Even the "apologetics" who go on about God's love don't think Jesus or Yahweh is all-forgiving; they believe Heaven comes at a price.

He definetely seems to be laying it on a bit thick in the bible, he's all "I'm badass and awesome and stuff", but for all we know he could be some wimp who decorates his house with pictures of Unicorns and loves the Care Bears. Hmm... this seems to remind me of something.

Can anyone guess what I am reminded of? :3

bencyjohn said...

i have my own views on god and i am trying to express it in my blog
www.bencyjohn.blogspot.com
pls feel free to come and comment

Luke said...

Awesome.

jacobwright said...

This is ignoral and unreasonable. You guys think you are really smart, but it is very childish reasoning. Check out this essay I did on this very subject:

http://blogs.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=blog.view&friendId=19042384&blogId=479452159

Nev said...

Nice work! I have Dawkin's quote on a T-Shirt, which I've translated so my girlfriend knows what it says. Maybe a native speaker can improve on it. (In Latin America < 1%, according to figures I've seen, class themselves as atheist).

El Dios del Antiguo Testamento es, podría ser dicho, el personaje más desagradable en toda ficción: celoso y orgulloso de ello; un controlador mezquino, injusto, y implacable; un vengativo limpiador étnico sediento de sangre; un matón misógino, homófobo, racista, infanticida, genocida, filicida, pestilente, megalómano, sadomasoquista, y caprichosamente malévolo.

Brucker said...

Why "The God of the Old Testament"? It's the same God through the whole Bible.

Ricardo Tavares Dias said...

What a bunch of ignorant comments.

If any of you wants to know who God is, you'll have to remove prejudice from your minds and get educated enough to read the Word of God as it should be read. Understand the story and the history. Understand the context and the text. You'll have to read the whole Bible and you'll se that both testaments speak of one and only God. A God of Love...and a God of Justice.

geraldo21 said...

Yes, perhaps Ricardo, I agree there is no sense god-bashing until pain is at stake.

Fortunately, however, a lot of people, myself included, have found sufficient meaning in their lives already without this delusion. To my people, there is no sense spending countless months reading a story, and further years studying or preaching it. It is, after all, just that: a story. If a person believes that this book is actually "the word of god from thousands of years ago," then it's quite clear that they have inherent delusional tendencies, and can probably be convinced that climate change is hoax of massive proportions by all of the politicians of the world, too.

Alas, we Atheists have decided to spend the months & years spared from reading this story actually accomplishing something with our time on Earth. Something senseful, something good for Life on Earth. Something real. Not preaching this non-sense, where the only good that comes from it, is that joyful period following the end of the war... the war that religion started in the first place.

The world will be in a natural state of peace only when there is no religion, or no human beings.

kadie said...

Geraldo21, if those of us how studie the Bible are wasting our time then aren't also Atheiste who spend their time telling us that we are wrong and trying to prove so also wasting their time?
War comes form human kind who is not perfect, we are all greed and and can never to prefect. It is true the we use religion to start wars, but that is not the purpose of religion. It is because of our greed that we try to religion to justify war. Really though I don't see myself in a believer of religion but in Christ who came to end religion.

Mary said...

Yes kadie Christ did come to put an end to religion. It's why he was killed. If you truly study Christ teachings, and what he was saying. You would come to know that the true GOD is Spirit, and the Kingdom of Heaven is with in us all.If you take a close look. The GOD of the Old Testament is a whole lot different from the GOD of the New Testament. I think that the teaching of Christ were taken some 300 years after he was killed and made to fit in with the Old Testament teaching to try and bring the followers, and control of the people they were losing back under their thumbs. To me they were losing to much money, from the loss, and control of the people. So out of greed, lust for power, and pettiness they invented a new religion to compliment the old one, and it worked. For a long time it has worked. Until man was able to read the written word for themselves that is.

Gary said...

This is Gary DeVaney of "The God Murders" website. Richard Dawkins has awakened Human awareness to the insane and murderous God of the Bible. I put God on Trial. Thinkers appreciate Bible C&V documentation that proves that Richard Dawkins in 100% on target. If any are truly interested:

www.thegodmurders.com

Thank you so much, Richard!

Regards, Gary DeVaney

pkgs said...

Should I thank who - ''god" --
If these lies were not fed to our ancestors - there would have been no Christianity and the Christians would not have killed Millions and Millions of people in the name of religion and till this day this slaughter is going on.
The stories which are taught to us as facts in the so called Holy books - a kid will laugh at it and he/she can make up better and more believable stories.

The Simple Scientist said...

@lockharts: When you butcher words like "definatly," you lose any and all credibility. Most English-speakers who were not home-schooled spell that word "definitely."

Thank you, Richard Dawkins, for giving the world your books, your knowledge and a path to overcome the ignorance of the past (and the present).

A Disciple of Christ said...

fenm: "You're operating under the assumption that lack of a Church and Christianity would be a bad thing..."


For a day in thy courts is better than a thousand. I had rather be a doorkeeper in the house of my God, than to dwell in the tents of wickedness. Psalms 84:10

Paul Arenas said...

You could repent. Moreover, you could ask God for eternal forgiveness through applying the death and resurrection of Jesus to your life of sin within the quietness of your bedroom tonight. As an unrepentant sinner myself, I made this decision around 15 years ago. This is the most important decision that you will ever make. “that if you confess with your mouth Jesus as Lord, and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved; for with the heart a person believes, resulting in righteousness, and with the mouth he confesses, resulting in salvation."
- Romans 10:9-10

Leonardo de la Paor said...

Picture the scene!

Darwin & Dawkins as bacteria on top of a giant lump of Elephant shit debating evolution.

Dawkins says to Darwin, "I believe in the Big Bang"!

"How come"? says Darwin.

"I heard it a few seconds ago & here we are"!

"Elementary, my dear Darwin"!

Leonardo de la Paor said...

Exodus 32:7-10

Is Moses schizophrenic & hearing voices in his head or is God talking to him?

If Moses is schizophrenic then the whole Chosen People & the Promised Land is a Lark in the Park, but if God is talking to him, then God is the FIRST anti-Semitic. He wanted to wipe the Israelites off the face of the earth & start again, but Moses pleaded with God not to & to give them another chance.

Moloch worship (the Golden Calf) offered human victims as sacrifices. The FIRST Jewish Holocaust happened in the Wilderness, right after Passover.Ask your local Jew why the Israelites had to spend 40 years in the Wilderness & he will either LIE or is ignorant of what happened.

See Babylonian Talmud Sanhedrin 64a to see how to offer human sacrifices & not be guilty!

The Simple Scientist said...

Few things are more ridiculous than trying to prove the truth of ancient scripture by quoting from that very scripture. That's a bit like saying "I'm right because I say I am" or "The Book of Mormon is clearly correct because it says it is correct." Expand your worldviews. Free yourselves.

How could tribes of ancient herdsmen know more about history, cosmology and theology than we could in 2011? The only honest answer is "They couldn't."

hoosierpastor said...

I respectfully disagree with the fundamental assertion of Dawkins and the original post. . . that anger is somehow ignoble or reprehensible in God. Anger is not the opposite of love, indifference is. When I read in the papers not long ago of a man who wrapped his infant son in cellophane and watched him slowly suffocate I became angry, very angry. I wanted something to be done about that kind of evil. I wanted justice. I believe that is the only moral response to that kind of evil. What would you say to a villager in Africa who has just watched his village being burned and his family brutalized. . . that it's immoral for him to become angry??? I submit that our anger at such evil is the natural and appropriate reflection of how God feels about such evil. That is what the anger of God is ultimately about. It is his righteous response to the evil which destroys the goodness, beauty and peace of his creation. Personally I could not believe in a "god" who is not angry about evil.

Leonardo de la Paor said...

Is it fair that 100,000,000 to 300,000,000 sperm are ejaculated by men & only ONE fertilizes the egg?

Some people would have you believe that all the sperm should the egg, even the ones with 2 heads & the ones with no tails.

I think God has people like Richard Dawkins play the "Devils Advocate"! This is a very important role & keeps believers on their toes. Good health to you, Richard & if you have any money left after being screwed by ATHEISTS, you could send us a few bob! Ho, ho, ho.

havocwing said...

The greatest madman to have ever lived.

havocwing said...

The greatest madman to have ever lived.

Leonardo de la Paor said...

"How could tribes of ancient herdsmen know more about history, cosmology and theology than we could in 2011? The only honest answer is "They couldn't."

Its quiet clear that the Hygiene Laws they had in the Wilderness were thousands of years before their time. The medium was religious ritual, the effect was hygiene among a couple million.
Deuteronomy 23:12-14. This one instruction saved them from contacted all kinds of airborne diseases. In parts of the world, even in the 21st century, people don't understand the importance of this instruction.

un servidor said...

The Hebrew word represented by the English word "jealous" is "qannah" which could more accurately be rendered, "possessing sensitive and deep feelings."

I want to testify that as well as I comprehend that I exist, I know that God lives, that He loves His children, and that He does all He does for their eternal welfare. I know this.

"For behold, this is my work and my glory, to bring to pass the immortality and Eternal life of man."

I invite each of you to seek Him in humility, and I promise "if from thence thou shalt seek the Lord thy God, thou shalt find him, if thou seek him with all thy heart and with all thy soul." (Deuteronomy 4:29)

"...weeping may endure for a night, but joy cometh in the morning." (Psalm 30:5)

larry said...

After further study & reading Spinoza, I now understand the problem in the Old Testament. The priest/scribe Ezra, the Babylonian diaspora Jew, on his return to Jerusalem REWROTE, ADDED TO the Jewish manuscript (s) & left them for the Pharisees to collate & canonize.
They created their god in THEIR image; in the image of a racist, blood thirsty Jew, they created him.

Marcion was right!

The god of the Jews is a MONSTER, who has been used to dupe Christians & Muslims.

jessica said...

Waye, hell's gonna be really crowded. Hey look at the bright side, you all can look at each other at the same time and say: WE WERE WRONG!

A Família Internacional de Embu das Artes said...

Well, Mr. Dawkins & following, after such a description of a God you unfortunately don't know much about, if that's the way He really is, you should be on your knees every day, praying He doesn't exist or making sure you don't offend Him!

Brett Kitt said...

The word "jealous" in the orginal translation, from what I understand, means "passionate". So what is God passionate about? How does passion work in our own human relationships? When is it good and when is it bad? The passion a Mother has for her child is the same passion God has for us. A good mother will try not to spoil her children and only hopes that they won't go out and run in traffic, however.. that's not something she can fully control. She wants real love. She wants a child who freely chooses to love her. She can only hope she has taught them well, and that they trust her teaching. The consequence is there, but it's not because a mother hates or doesn't love her son. It's because when a car hits you, you get hurt. I don't think anyone would deny that. She will still love her son after he gets hit by a car... she will love him if He doesn't... tho she might be more proud and less stresssed. haha. this is the love of our Father God. It's not because we can earn it or deserve it, IT JUST IS! God is LOVE. HE is IT. The understanding of this comes from God, it is a gift. However gifts must be recieved, opened, and accepted. Everything is relative folks. And once God reveals this to you through seeking, everything will start to make a lot more sense. Everything. It takes time though, as any human earthly relationship takes time. God will never let you down though. He will always pull through. I pray that anyone who reads this can understand what I'm saying, and the truth I have found, and the joy of conversation with God, and the relationship. It's amazing.

The Simple Scientist said...

Brett, when you talk about God, do you mean Yahweh? Or Allah? Zeus? Or maybe Hanuman the monkey god? There are so many gods out there to choose from, how do you know which one to worship? Perhaps you mean a passionate Poseidon? You really owe it to yourself to read more than 1 ancient holybook and attend more than 1 kind of religious service. Amen for a passionate Venus, the goddess of love!

beinghuman123 said...

It's funny how religions say that God is loving and forgiving when he is anything but.

I hate how every religion claims to be right and says that the others are wrong. Jesus never intended to start another religion like some people claim. He hated the Pharisees and over turned tables in the temples.

Bill Graham said...

My mother has an illustrated Book of Genesis. I can't even make it through a dozen pages before wishing that the Galactic Child Protective Services would swoop in and take custody of the planet.

Change the scene and the names and is there ANYONE ANYWHERE who could condone such behavior?

And sadly there have been countless millions of souls since forced into all manner of mental/emotional/philosophical gyrations trying to 'spin' such abject horror into something positive or instructive.

Christianity lost me at age 5 with the Noah's Ark story when I didn't see Kangaroos. Reading about this particular version of God's sociopathic behavior isn't likely to win me back from a generally Daoist perspective.

larry said...

Yo to all of true, sincere, seekers of truth!

MISHNAH. HE WHO GIVES OF HIS SEED TO MOLECH INCURS NO PUNISHMENT UNLESS HE DELIVERS IT TO MOLECH AND CAUSES IT TO PASS THROUGH THE FIRE. IF HE GAVE IT TO MOLECH BUT DID NOT CAUSE IT TO PASS THROUGH THE FIRE, OR THE REVERSE, HE INCURS NO PENALTY, UNLESS HE DOES BOTH.

Babylonian Talmud, Tractate Sanhedrin 64a
Soncino 1961 Edition, page 437

Following the Mishnah is a discussion among the sages. One of the Talmud Sages, Rabbi Ashi, comments as follows:

GEMARA. R. Ashi propounded: What if one caused his blind or sleeping son to pass through, (3) or if he caused his grandson by his son or daughter to pass through? — One at least of these you may solve. For it has been taught: [Any men … that giveth any of his seed unto Molech; he shall he put to death … And I will set my face against that man, and will cut him off from among his people;] because he hath given of his seed unto Molech. Why is this stated? — Because it is said, there shall not be found among you any one that maketh his son or his daughter to pass through the fire. From this I know it only of his son or daughter. Whence do I know that it applies to his son's son or daughter's son too? From the verse, [And if the people of the land do any ways hide their eyes from the man] when he giveth of his seed unto Molech [and kill him not: Then I will … cut him off.]

— Babylonian Talmud, Tractate Sanhedrin 64b
Soncino 1961 Edition, page 439

Aaron offered Human Sacrifices to Moloch aka The Golden Calf on Mount Sinai (Exodus 32; Amos 5; Acts 7:42-43) & all through the Jewish Bible you will see that they continued to do it. The Babylonian Talmud teaches them how to do it TODAY!

NOW THAT IS WORRYING.

larry said...

Jesus prayed:

“I thank thee, Father, Lord of heaven and earth, that thou hast hidden these things from the wise and understanding and revealed them to babes; yea, Father, for such was thy gracious will.”

I DESIRE MERCY, NOT SACRIFICE

Have you never questioned the idea of killing a man to appease God?

Jesus says:

MATTHEW 9

[13] Go and learn what this means, `I desire mercy, and not sacrifice.' For I came not to call the righteous, but sinners.

MATTHEW 12

[7] And if you had known what this means, `I desire mercy, and not sacrifice,' you would not have condemned the guiltless.
The prophet says:
Hos.6
[6] For I desire steadfast love and not sacrifice, the knowledge of God, rather than burnt offerings. . ..

The above are true witnesses. Now, here are some examples of the many false witnesses:

The likes of Billy Graham and Co state:

In ancient Judaism the shedding of blood was to make atonement for sin. The word "blood" in the Old and the New Testaments symbolized a life that was given. Jesus Christ became the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world for the sins of the world.

Another witness testifies as follows:

By His death on the cross, the Lord Jesus made a perfect atonement for sin, by which the wrath of God against sinners is appeased and a ground furnished upon which God can deal in mercy with sinners. He redeemed us from the curse of the law by becoming a curse in our place. He Who Himself was absolutely without sin was made sin on our behalf that we might become the righteousness of God in Him.

And yet another testifies:

Jesus—We believe that Jesus is the Son of God, was born of a virgin, was wholly God and wholly man, lived a sinless life, died in our place as a sacrifice for the sins of mankind, was buried, arose bodily from the grave, and ascended into Heaven.

Of the many false doctrines of Christendom, none can be more heinous to the Father than this -- that He required His innocent Son, Jesus of Nazareth, to atone for the sins of humans by suffering the horrible death of crucifixion, thus becoming a vicarious, sacrificial atonement. It is heinous because it renders men --

1. Blind to the true message of the Old Testament scriptures,
2. Deaf to the voice of Jesus,
3. Utterly ignorant as to the merciful nature of God and
4. Seals their condemnation who might otherwise have found salvation.

Dan Barker said...

Under "Genocidal," Deuteronomy 13:5 should be Deuteronomy 13:15

Steve Wells said...

Thanks Dan. I've made the correction.

Let me know if you find any more.

Dan Barker said...

Steve,

I can't find your email address. Send me an email to dbarker AT ffrf DOT org

I am working on a new book and crediting the SAB and Drunk With Blood as a resource.

larry said...

DAWKINS IS A HYPOCRITE

GOOGLE:

Richard Dawkins condemns the Myth of the Chosen People & the Promised Land!

---------------------------

That's right - NOTHING!

Dawkins hasn't the BALLS to condemn the Zionist Jews who use these MYTHS to massacre thousands of Arabs in Palestine, BECAUSE he wants to get his BOOKS printed & he knows who controls WORLD publishing! Yep - JEWS!

A proud mana said...

I have had a problem with the Old Testament for some time. God is petty, ugly, vindictive, hateful, bigoted and unjust. My minister says it was reflective of a lawless time. Then why do we still read this junk on Sunday? Then we get to the New Testament and God is a kinder and gentler version of himself or is he? What father sends his son to be killed to rid us of sin? Why couldn't god just forgive? That in my mind would be a loving god, not the one portrayed in the bible. My head cannot wrap itself around the bible. And faith...to be a sheep, stupid, unquestioning with brain that accepts crap and says it is god's own word. Ya right!