27 November 2013

Pope Francis: Islam and the Quran are opposed to every form of violence

In his first apostolic exhortation, Evangelii Gaudium ("The Joy of the Gospel"), Pope Francis pontificates about Islam.

Here's what he said in paragraph 253.
Faced with disconcerting episodes of violent fundamentalism, our respect for true followers of Islam should lead us to avoid hateful generalizations, for authentic Islam and the proper reading of the Koran are opposed to every form of violence.
So according to Pope Francis, we should replace "hateful generalizations" about Islam and the Quran with the hopeful (and obviously false) generalizations that Islam and the Quran "are opposed to every form of violence."

It is, of course, obvious to anyone who has read the Quran or today's newspaper that the pope's generalization is false. Islam is not opposed to every form of violence, and neither is the Quran.

Here are some verses from the Quran that the pope assures us are completely nonviolent.
  1. Slay them wherever ye find them, and drive them out of the places  whence they drove you out ... If  they attack you (there) then slay them. Such is the reward of disbelievers. Quran 2:191
  2. Fight them until persecution is no more, and religion is for Allah. 2:193
  3. We shall cast terror into the hearts of those who disbelieve. 3:151
  4. Men are in charge of women, because Allah hath made the one of them to excel the other. ... So good women are the obedient. ... As for those from whom ye fear rebellion, admonish them and banish them to beds  apart, and scourge them. 4:34
  5. Those who disbelieve Our revelations, We shall expose them to the Fire. As often as their skins are consumed We shall exchange them for fresh skins that they may taste the torment. 4:56
  6. Those who believe do battle for the cause of Allah; and those who disbelieve do battle for the cause of idols. So fight the minions of the devil. 4:76
  7. Choose not friends from them [unbelievers]. ... Take them and kill them  wherever ye find them. 4:89
  8. Take them [unbelievers] and kill them wherever ye find them. Against such We have given you clear warrant. 4:91
  9. The disbelievers are an open enemy to you. 4:101
  10. Choose not disbelievers for (your) friends in place of  believers. Would ye give Allah a clear warrant against you? 4:144
  11. The only reward of those who make war upon Allah and His messenger ... will be that they will be killed or crucified, or have their hands and feet on alternate sides cut off, or will be expelled out of the land. Such  will be their degradation in the world, and in the Hereafter theirs will be an awful doom. 5:33
  12. As for the thief, both male and female, cut off their hands. ... An exemplary punishment from Allah. 5:38
  13. Take not the Jews and the Christians for friends. ... He among you who taketh them for friends is (one) of them. 5:51
  14. The Jews ... We have cast among them enmity and hatred till the Day of Resurrection. 5:64
  15. I will throw fear into the hearts of those who disbelieve. Then smite the necks and smite of them each finger. 8:12
  16. Fight them until persecution is no more, and religion is all for Allah. 8:39
  17. It is not for any prophet to have captives until he hath made slaughter in the land. 8:67
  18. Slay the idolaters wherever ye  find them, and take them (captive), and besiege them, and prepare for them each ambush. 9:5
  19. Choose not your fathers nor your brethren for friends if they take pleasure in disbelief rather than faith. Whoso of you taketh them for friends, such are wrong-doers. 9:23
  20. The Jews ... and the Christians ... Allah (Himself) fighteth against them. How  perverse are they! 9:30
  21. O Prophet! Strive against the disbelievers and the hypocrites! Be harsh with  them. Their ultimate abode is hell, a hapless journey's end. 9:73
  22. O ye who believe! Fight those of the disbelievers who are near to you, and  let them find harshness in you. 9:123
  23. But as for those who disbelieve, garments of fire will  be cut out for them; boiling fluid will be poured down on their heads, Whereby that which is in their bellies, and their skins too, will be melted; And for them are hooked rods of iron. 22:19-21
  24. Muhammad is the messenger of Allah. And those with him are hard against the disbelievers and merciful among themselves. 48:29
  25. Those who take for friends a folk with whom Allah is wroth ... Allah hath prepared for them a dreadful doom. 58:14
  26. Tell their  brethren who disbelieve among the People of the Scripture ... that they verily are liars. 59:11
  27. O ye who believe! Choose not My enemy and your enemy for allies. Do ye give them friendship when they disbelieve? 60:1
  28. O Prophet! Strive against the disbelievers and the hypocrites, and be stern with them. Hell will be their home, a hapless journey's end. 66:9



20 comments:

Yark Hutprancer said...

Popes are worthless.

paarsurrey said...

@ dwindlinginunbelief

Thanks for providing a list of some 30 places from Quran where you thing Quran teaches violence instead of peace.

I think you are an intelligent person; please select just ONE verse from it which you think is the most violent one among them.

We will discuss the verse here to find whether it is peaceful or violent one.?

Will you do it please?

paarsurrey said...

@ dwindlinginunbelief

Today is the fourth day that I requested you to choose from your list, One- most violent verse of Quran.

No response is forthcoming.
I think you might have not read the Quran yourself; and just copied/pasted the list from some other website in opposition of Quran/Islam/Muhammad.

If it would have naturally occurred to one while reading Quran ; one might not have prepared the list to start with; as there is no violent verse in Quran if understood correctly from the context verses.

I think you agree with me.

Do you? Please

Steve Wells said...

paarsurrey,

OK. How about 5:33?

"The only reward of those who make war upon Allah and His messenger and strive after corruption in the land will be that they will be killed or crucified, or have their hands and feet on alternate sides cut off, or will be expelled out of the land. Such will be their degradation in the world, and in the Hereafter theirs will be an awful doom."

But all 28 of these verses are violent, paarsurrey. If you dispute that, please select just ONE verse which you think is the least violent among them.

paarsurrey said...

@ Steve Wells : Sun Feb 09, 02:14:00 PM 2014

I now give below the verse 5:33 selected by you with the verses in the context from Quran:

[5:28] And relate to them truly the story of the two sons of Adam, when they each offered an offering, and it was accepted from one of them and was not accepted from the other. The latter said, ‘I will surely kill thee.’ The former replied, ‘Allah accepts only from the righteous.
[5:29] ‘If thou stretch out thy hand against me to kill me, I am not going to stretch out my hand against thee to kill thee. I do fear Allah, the Lord of the universe.
[5:30] ‘I wish that thou shouldst bear my sin as well as thy sin, and thus be among the inmates of the Fire, and that is the reward of those who do wrong.’
[5:31] But his mind induced him to kill his brother, so he killed him and became one of the losers.
[5:32] Then Allah sent a raven which scratched in the ground, that He might show him how to hide the corpse of his brother. He said, ‘Woe is me! Am I not able to be even like this raven so that I may hide the corpse of my brother?’ And then he became regretful.
[5:33] On account of this, We prescribed for the children of Israel that whosoever killed a person — unless it be for killing a person or for creating disorder in the land — it shall be as if he had killed all mankind; and whoso gave life to one, it shall be as if he had given life to all mankind. And Our Messengers came to them with clear Signs, yet even after that, many of them commit excesses in the land.
[5:34] The reward of those who wage war against Allah and His Messenger and strive to create disorder in the land is only this that they be slain or crucified or their hands and their feet be cut off on alternate sides, or they be expelled from the land. That shall be a disgrace for them in this world, and in the Hereafter they shall have a great punishment;
[5:35] Except those who repent before you have them in your power. So know that Allah is Most Forgiving, Merciful.
[5:36] O ye who believe! fear Allah and seek the way of approach unto Him and strive in His way that you may prosper.
[5:37] Surely, if those who disbelieve had all that is in the earth and as much over again, to ransom themselves therewith from the punishment of the Day of Resurrection, it would not be accepted from them; and they shall have a painful punishment.

http://www.alislam.org/quran/search2/showChapter.php?ch=5&verse=28

Now you have to prove that the teachings mentioned in the verses are against the norms of the society and are violent.

Please go through them and prove your viewpoint.

Thanks

Steve Wells said...

You're a funny guy, paarsurrey.

I have to "prove" that chopping off hands and feet on alternate sides or crucifying people is "against the norms of society."

Well, it depends on what society you're talking about. If it's a Muslim society, then it'd be in perfect accordance with their fucked up societal norms. Chopping off hands, feet, heads -- it's all a normal part of life for those who try to obey the Quran and Muhammad.

Do you think its cruel to cut off a person's hand, foot, or head, paarsurrey? Is it OK to crucify people who oppose Islam?

Please go through and prove your viewpoint.

paarsurrey said...

@Steve Wells said :Mon Feb 10, 09:29:00 AM 2014

Please don't mind a little question, Which country do you live in?

Sorry, it is a personal information; answer only if you don't mind; no compulsion, please.

Steve Wells said...

No problem, paarsurrey.

I live in the United States of America.

paarsurrey said...

@Steve Wells : Mon Feb 10, 03:39:00 PM 2014

Thank you for informing me that you live in the USA. It is a good state to live in; and many of my kith and kin live there and enjoy life there.

Please again peruse the verses of Quran I have quoted; you may read as many verses before them and after them as you like; you will realize that the verses don’t discuss anybody’s conversion to Islam by force; this is not all the subject matter of the verses.
Quran is for ethical, moral and spiritual up-lift of the human beings; it has got nothing to do with ruling any territory/ies and grabbing power.

The verses are general for everybody Muslim or non-Muslim. A Muslim who is cruel and jealous of others and persecutes others for the bounties others have got; he is as fit to receive the punishment and wrath of the One-True-God as those who don’t believe in Islam. This is exactly mentioned in the verses. In fact terrorism and its punishment is discussed in them, not literally but in so many words.

It is for this that I wrote you “to prove that the teachings mentioned in the verses are against the norms of the society and are violent”.

Thanks for joining the discussion; others could also join the discussion if they don’t agree with me.

After all it is a friendly discussion.

Steve Wells said...

@paarsurrey,

So you're not going to answer my question? Here it is again, in case you've forgotten.

Do you think its cruel to cut off a person's hand, foot, or head? Is it OK to crucify people who oppose Islam?

Quran 5:33 (or 34, depending on translations) says this:

"The only reward of those who make war upon Allah and His messenger and strive after corruption in the land will be that they will be killed or crucified, or have their hands and feet on alternate sides cut off, or will be expelled out of the land. Such will be their degradation in the world, and in the Hereafter theirs will be an awful doom."

Sounds cruel and violent to me. How about you, paarsurrey?

paarsurrey said...

@ Steve Wells : Tue Feb 11, 09:50:00 AM 2014

Regarding Cutting of leg Please read the following:

Leg Amputation

When you have a blockage or narrowing of the arteries supplying your legs, the circulation to your legs is reduced. You may have developed pain in your foot or feet waking you at night, ulceration, or black areas on your toes, feet or leg.
If severe arterial disease is left untreated, the lack of blood circulation will cause the pain to increase. Tissue in the leg will die due to lack of oxygen and nutrients, which leads to infection and gangrene. In some cases, gangrene can be very dangerous as the infection can spread through the body and become life-threatening.
Amputation is always a last resort and will only be recommended if your surgeon has decided it is not possible to improve the circulation in any other way.
The main sites of amputation are;
• Just below the knee
• Through the knee
• Through the thigh
The site of amputation will depend on how poor the blood supply to your leg is. If possible, below knee amputations are performed, as it is easier to walk with an artificial limb after the operation. However, many people do well after a thigh amputation. The following information will help to explain the procedure of leg amputation:

http://www.circulationfoundation.org.uk/help-advice/peripheral-arterial-disease/leg-amputation/

Do you think the Doctor who operates and cuts off a leg infected by gangrene; he does a cruel act?

Steve Wells said...

@paarsurrey,

Allah isn't talking about medical amputation in verse 5:33.

Here it is again: "Those who make war upon Allah and His messenger .... will be killed or crucified, or have their hands and feet on alternate sides cut off, or will be expelled out of the land. Such will be their degradation in the world, and in the Hereafter theirs will be an awful doom."

Crucifixion is seldom an effective medical procedure.

Why not just admit that the Quran is cruel?

paarsurrey said...

@Steve Wells :Wed Feb 12, 01:36:00 PM 2014

I repeat my question? Please answer.


Do you think the Doctor who operates and cuts off a leg infected by gangrene; he does a cruel act?

Please answer

Steve Wells said...

@paarsurrey,

You asked: "Do you think the Doctor who operates and cuts off a leg infected by gangrene; he does a cruel act?"

No, of course not.

Is that what Quran 5:33 is about? When Allah says you should cut off a hand and a foot on alternate sides of the body, he's talking about a necessary medical procedure?

And how about crucifixion. Is that a necessary medical procedure too?

Is this really the best you can do, paarsurrey?

paarsurrey said...

@Steve Wells said:Tue Feb 18, 04:36:00 PM 2014

The verses mention that those who do acts of terrorism and spread chaos in the society; they deserve to be punished more severely than the normal killers; of course within the law of the land. In fact terrorism and its punishment are discussed here, not literally but in so many words.

This is but the norm of the worldwide international society; the terrorists are bombed.

The Quran does not allow to do any excesses on them, it is very clearly mentioned in the verses; that if they do such measures; then of course the society could punish them likewise, but no innocents should be killed with them and there should be no collateral damage. If the terrorists crucify or cut off the arms or legs of the public; they should be retaliated accordingly by the law.

It is for this that I wrote you to prove that the teachings mentioned in the verses are against the norms of the society.

Like a doctor cuts off the leg of a patient so that the infection may not spread to the whole body; similarly the society should punish the terrorists to save the humanity from their peril.

We can conclude, therefore, that the Quran verses [5:28] to [5:37] are nothing but peaceful.

Now, we can discuss another verse from your list.

http://paarsurrey.wordpress.com/

Steve Wells said...

@paarsurrey,

Here is the verse that you say is "nothing but peaceful" and consistent with "the norm of the worldwide international society":

"Those who make war upon Allah and His messenger .... will be killed or crucified, or have their hands and feet on alternate sides cut off." Quran 5:33

So you think that anyone who "makes war" on Allah or Muhammad should be crucified or have their hands and feet on alternate sides cut off? And this is perfectly peaceful? If so, you are insane.

Crucifixion and cutting off hands and feet are not acceptable punishments for anyone (certainly not for opposing the teachings of the Quran or Muhammad).

paarsurrey said...

@Steve Wells said :Wed Feb 19, 03:51:00 PM 2014


Now, we can discuss another verse from your list.

Please select another ONE verse from your long list.

Is there one? please

http://paarsurrey.wordpress.com/

Steve Wells said...

@paarsurrey,

So you agree that Quran 5:33 is cruel and violent? If so, then there's no need to go on. We agree that the Quran contains at least one cruel and violent verse.

If not, then there's no need to go on, since crucifixion and chopping off hands and feet don't seem cruel or violent to you.

Is anything cruel or violent to you, paarsurrey?

paarsurrey said...

"So you agree that Quran 5:33 is cruel and violent?"

Did I say that?

The main post inform the pope that there are some 28 verses with violence.

@ steve wells

So you have a chance to discuss another verse, one by one, till all 28 verses are discussed; then we will discuss them in general and classify them.

Have a patience and do a little research in Quran by reading it yourself as I discussed vide my post of Sat Feb 08, 12:18:00 PM 2014.

Shamsa Farooq said...

In my judgment, Quran is the best book for Humans. Please also visit an old website Learning Quran for kids as well.