OK, I missed Darwin's birthday, but it's still Darwin Week. So I thought I'd post one of my favorite Darwin quotes. Here it is:
I cannot persuade myself that a beneficent & omnipotent God would have designedly created the Ichneumonidae with the express intention of their feeding within the living bodies of caterpillars, or that a cat should play with mice. -- From a letter to Asa Gray, 22 Mary 1860
The ichneumonidae is a family of wasps. A very big family. It is, in fact, one of the largest families in the largest class of animals, the insects. There are over 60,000 species of ichneumonid wasps, each one, according to creationists, specially designed by God. My question for them is the same as Charles Darwin's: Why? Why would a beneficent and omnipotent God do such a thing?
To understand the question, it is necessary to know a bit about the ichneumonids. First of all, most are parasitoids, which means that their larvae develop inside the body of a living host, which they slowly eat alive. Eventually, when the wasp larvae pupate, they erupt out of the body of the host that they have gradually consumed, tormented, and destroyed as larvae.
It is easy to see how such a thing could exist from an evolutionary standpoint. The body of a caterpillar is good food for larvae. It's not surprising that some organisms have evolved to take advantage of it. But what kind of a God would purposefully design it to be that way?
I have heard five different answers:
- God originally made everything good; there was no suffering or death until the fall of Adam. Then all hell broke loose. Animals immediately began to kill and eat each other, and predators, parasites, parasitoids, and pathogens roamed the earth. (Answers in Genesis)
- God made things nasty right from the start just to show us how important we are to him. He knew that Adam would sin, so he made nature cruel to show us the serious nature of sin. (Dembski's Defective Design Inference)
- God made everything good and then Satan messed everything up. (Satanic Insects)
- God likes it just fine the way it is. He created it that way for is own pleasure. He likes to watch things suffer. (David Snoke)
- God couldn't help it and had nothing to do with it. He would have liked to create a kind and peaceful world, but he had to let things play out according to the laws of nature, over which he had no control. So the ichneumonid wasps just evolved, along with everything else, over millions of years while God sadly watched from a distance, unable to affect the outcome. (Ken Miller)
For each of these answers, though, I have a question.
- How did things change so quickly? Were the 60,000 ichneumonid species specially created by God the moment Adam sinned? Or did God magically turn 60,000 butterfly species into parasitic wasps? Or did they all evolve (super)naturally in a few thousand years?
- How do the ichneumonids teach us about sin? Until about the time of Darwin no one (except God) even knew they existed? Yet God created them just for us, just to teach us a lesson?
- So Satan created the Ichneumonids? Along with scorpions, spiders, snakes, and sharks? He must have been a busy guy!
- How could a kind and loving God create things just to watch them suffer?
- A God who can't create or control anything isn't a God at all.
Here are some cool videos about the Ichneumonids.
The first one is from David Attenborough's marvelous "Life in the Undergrowth."
And here's one showing a Ichneumonid wasp (Megarhyssa sp.) drilling through the bark of an oak tree to deposit an egg in the tunnel of the siricid wood wasp, whose larva the Maegarhyssa lava will eat alive from the inside in the traditional Ichneumonid fashion (just like God intended it to be).
13 comments:
Damn. That second wasp is pretty incredible. How big are these things? And how much do they like people intruding on their private affairs with a video camera?
;)
FrodoSaves,
Yeah, they're pretty cool, aren't they? I've never seen one oviposit before, but it is one of my goals in life. I understand, though, that they are pretty vulnerable at that time and can't just fly away when their ovipositor is stuck a cm or so into tree bark. Here's what Borror and Delong's Study of Insects says about it.
"Retraction of the ovipositor is also relatively slow. It is not uncommon to find what look like thin, black needles protruding from the wood of a dead tree. These are the ovipositors of females that either were unable to free themselves or were eaten by birds while ovipositing."
Sure!
If any god would design such creatures it would be the genocidal, psychopathic, torture & human sacrifice loving Judeo-Christian-Islamic god.
The comment about birds eating the wasps got me thinking:
We don't even have to talk about parasitic wasps to doubt that all life was created by a loving, just God. That beautiful cardinal singing outside your window on a spring morning? Yeah, he's going to kill and devour hundreds of living creatures (insects, worms, spiders, etc.) over the course of a life that very easily could end in horrible violence as he is plucked from the sky by a Coopers Hawk.
The fact that animals that we find beautiful and majestic are routinely killing each other just to survive is enough proof against a just, loving God for me.
Busterggi,
I agree. The god of the Bible and the god of nature are both cruel and sadistic. Thank goodness there's no evidence for the existence of either of them.
Ian,
You're absolutely right. Nature is from top to bottom red in tooth and claw. No one but a sadist would have designed it to be that way.
How could a kind and loving God create things just to watch them suffer?
He is God; He felt like it.
He's God; He felt like it.
So God just felt like creating things just so he could watch them suffer? And you worship this God?
So God just felt like creating things just so he could watch them suffer? And you worship this God?
What if he's a masochist?
Nah, i joke. I don't understand how people can live with such unrealistic expectations. everything suffers. its a fact of life. what do you expect?
What if he's a masochist?
I guess you mean sadist, eh Xolotl-Tzin?
Everything suffers because God (if there is one) purposefully designed it that way.
So much for the KFC (Kind, Friendly Creator) theory.
I guess you mean sadist, eh Xolotl-Tzin?
Nah. this was my bad. by masochist i am referring to the guy who said God made 'em. Not god himself. :)
If you like a sadistic god, you'd have to be a masochist hm?
I'm sorry, but I don't understand you comment, Zolotl-Tzin.
So God just felt like creating things just so he could watch them suffer? And you worship this God?
Yes, He is Lord of Lords and King of Kings.
"He is Lord of Lords and King of Kings.
And Lord of the flies.
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