10 March 2010

All God's Killings: Search the scriptures to find them all

Those who have been following along with me know that I'm nearing the end of God's killings, at least those that I've included on the list. I worry, though, that I've missed some and I'd like to make the list as complete as possible, giving God all the credit or blame that is due, depending on one's point of view.

So I'll be starting another series of posts on God's suspected killings, those killings in which God would be a "person of interest" based upon the evidence provided by the Bible.

And I'd like you all to help me with this. Search the scriptures to uncover the bodies in the Bible and find scriptural evidence for God's guilt or innocence. Then let me know in the comments or by email, so we can start an investigation. Let's not let any of these cases become cold.

I'd especially like help on this from believers (I know you're out there). It's your book and your God. So you should be interested in knowing whom he has killed and why. Once you are convinced that God was responsible for a particular killing, why not explain why the killing was justified in the comments or guest post?

Because when it comes to these cases, we are all believers, with the Bible our only witness and its words infallible (except when it contradicts itelf).


Zerilos said...

Have you mentioned the fact that he killed his own son; Ananias and Sapphria; Judas (according to Acts); a heard of swine; Herod;

Steve Wells said...

All except Judas, Zerilos. I guess we should look into his death. Was it a suicide or did God make his bowels fall out?

teavee said...

It might be interesting to look at God saving lives rather than taking lives. He kept the Israelites alive in the desert with manna and water and protected them from others. But then their being kept alive allowed them and later generations to kill others. God could be considered indirectly responsible for all those that the Israelites killed without God's help. How often does God intervene to protect someone who would have been killed or disabled that later kills someone else? How often for someone who later does good?

twillight said...

I'm sorry that I can't help you Steve.
For the next 25 years or so I'll have my hobby: translating the Babylonian Talmud to hungarian.
I'm so Jelous on you guys, whose mother-language is english (or german, or french as I heared).

Steve Wells said...

Oh, I see, teavee. Start counting the number of people that God didn't kill in the Bible. That sounds like fun; I'll let you do it.

I wonder how many people Hitler didn't kill.

teavee said...

I was just throwing out an idea but gave a poor example. I was wondering if any specific verses talk about God protecting a specific person by supernatural intervention that would carry out future retribution that God destined them for.

The Israelites came to mind but are not a good example of what I was thinking of. I should not think all of them to be guilty because of the actions of some of them or of their offspring or descendents that they should not be helped by a deity if stranded in a desert.

teavee said...

How about Luke 13:4-5?
"Or those eighteen, upon whom the tower in Siloam fell, and slew them, think ye that they were sinners above all men that dwelt in Jerusalem? I tell you, Nay: but, except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish." (Would an insurance company back then have considered it an "Act of God"?) The verses do not say God did not cause it, just that they were not the worst sinners (but supposedly still sinners to some extent). The verses seem to suggest that is still the way the unrepentant sinners perish, supposedly by God's arranging such "accidents".

Steve Wells said...

That's an interesting one, teavee.

Jesus seems to be saying that the tower didn't fall on the 18 people because they were especially sinful.

"Think ye that they were sinners above all men that dwelt in Jerusalem? I tell you, Nay."

It was just an accident. Shit happens.

But then Jesus had to go on and say something really stupid.

"Except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish."

Everyone will perish. Repenting can't stop it anymore than it can stop a tower from falling.

But I don't see a killing for God here. Jesus says it just happened and God had nothing to do with it.

teavee said...

I agree it was likely just an accident for the 18 if they weren't too sinful, but to me the verses seem to suggest a little that it didn't have to be purely an accident.

There is also Luke 12:20 "But God said unto him, Thou fool, this night thy soul shall be required of thee:..." suggesting that God decides/arranges when people die." and Psalms 139:16 (see NIV) saying all our days are pre-ordained before birth by God. But then that would cover all the deaths/murders in the Bible.

Brucker said...

I was going to suggest Lazarus' death in John 11 as a possibility, and while you haven't included it in your list, you seem from your comments on that chapter to consider it Jesus' fault. Jesus didn't kill Lazarus, but he allowed him to die when he could have healed him. What do you say?

Hmm... Of course, if you allow that, some other situations become problematic. If God is responsible for Jesus' death, then he might be considered somewhast culpable in the death of the two thieves crucified with him; after all, he theoretically could have saved them.

Steve Wells said...

You might be right about Lazarus, Brucker. God might have killed him so that Jesus could show off by bringing him back to life. But he might have just let him die a natural death, too. There's plenty of room for reasonable doubt about that one.

And I agree with you about the thieves, too. God should have saved them, and a decent God would have. But he didn't kill them, either. He just stood back and watched like he always does (unless he's busy killing people).

Matthew Blanchette said...

Oooh, this'll be a fun project... :-D